Relative to the sun the vast majority of the U.S. is to high up on the globe to have solar be a strong candidate for energy. If one looks at the solar radiation maps here http://www.nrel.gov/gis/images/map_pv_national_lo-res.jpg
and here
http://www.nrel.gov/gis/images/map_csp_national_lo-res.jpg
One can clearly see the problem with solar, that is why there are huge government subsidies, yet it is still super costly for a home owner. The other problem, the "grid" Why?, it is independently owned by over 500 companies.
"Clean coal"? No such thing according to the powerful EPA.
Oil, an old standby, but drilling permits are scarce and BP didn't really help it..
Nuclear? Again 3 mile island put that out of reach...
So all you left leaning folks where and how is America to get power? Hydroelectric is another great clean source, again limited by location and the grid.
Inquiring minds want to know... what is the plan for the future?
and here
http://www.nrel.gov/gis/images/map_csp_national_lo-res.jpg
One can clearly see the problem with solar, that is why there are huge government subsidies, yet it is still super costly for a home owner. The other problem, the "grid" Why?, it is independently owned by over 500 companies.
"Clean coal"? No such thing according to the powerful EPA.
Oil, an old standby, but drilling permits are scarce and BP didn't really help it..
Nuclear? Again 3 mile island put that out of reach...
So all you left leaning folks where and how is America to get power? Hydroelectric is another great clean source, again limited by location and the grid.
Inquiring minds want to know... what is the plan for the future?
+3 Votes
Under Obama the EPA has become a monster organization, yet we still need alternative sources of energy, after all global warming is a proven science that we can only fight by reducing the our carbon footprint, right? Many will argue, as I do that having only a few decades of data relative to the global warming issue makes "global warming" a tough sell.
However...
If it's time to say "yes the humans are the problem" how do you fix it? Taxes, via African run U.N. efforts like Agenda 21 etc.?
However...
If it's time to say "yes the humans are the problem" how do you fix it? Taxes, via African run U.N. efforts like Agenda 21 etc.?
ROJODEE 4 hours ago
+4 Votes
Thorium.....but it is not worth discussing really..the status quo will remain .....to much fear of new things...so let it progess to the logical conclusion...life will go on..the planet itself will solve the issue...
TheScott 3 hours ago
+3 Votes
Actually, thorium is not a new technology at all and has so many good attributes but the only reason that we do not is.............. plutonium. Thorium does not require highly enriched uranium235 and will not have as a by product plutonium..... This is the problem with Irans argument that they 'just want to create energy. Thorium would do that but it wouldn't be worth a dammmm on top of a rocket.
One thing that thorium reactors will do is reuse the existing waste that we currently have...and they CAN'T melt down.
One thing that thorium reactors will do is reuse the existing waste that we currently have...and they CAN'T melt down.
ROJODEE 3 hours ago
+2 Votes
Yes sir I know ..not able to be weaponized.....too abundant..too scaleable...able to be shileded with aluminum...too many positive things to ever be considered..sad really
stndyogrnd 3 hours ago
Thorium ( /'???ri?m/ thohr-ee-?m) is a natural radioactive chemical element with the symbol Th and atomic number 90. It was discovered in 1828 and named after Thor, the Norse god of thunder.
In nature, virtually all thorium is found as thorium-232, and it decays by emitting an alpha particle, and has a half-life of about 14.05 billion years (other, trace-level isotopes of thorium are short-lived intermediates of decay chains). It is estimated to be about four times more abundant than uranium in the Earth's crust and is a by-product of the extraction of rare earths from monazite sands. Thorium was formerly used commonly as (for example) the light source in gas mantles and as an alloying material, but these applications have declined due to concerns about its radioactivity. Thorium is also used as an alloying element in non consumable TIG welding electrodes.less
In nature, virtually all thorium is found as thorium-232, and it decays by emitting an alpha particle, and has a half-life of about 14.05 billion years (other, trace-level isotopes of thorium are short-lived intermediates of decay chains). It is estimated to be about four times more abundant than uranium in the Earth's crust and is a by-product of the extraction of rare earths from monazite sands. Thorium was formerly used commonly as (for example) the light source in gas mantles and as an alloying material, but these applications have declined due to concerns about its radioactivity. Thorium is also used as an alloying element in non consumable TIG welding electrodes.less
MrSandman 3 hours ago
+3 Votes
Really, when you block copy something from Wikipedia you ought to mention that it is block copied from Wikipedia. This is called attribution.
stndyogrnd 3 hours ago
LOL why ... when you will make a point of doing so..... this is called "I really don't care about your rules"
LiveStrongest 2 hours ago
+1 Vote
It's not his rules. It's the rules of this site.
And technically it's the law of the land. But I guess you don't care.
I attribute everything. So do the other right wingers.
Maybe honesty and integrity don't matter to you left wing cra-cra
stndyogrnd 3 hours ago
Canada, Germany, India, Netherlands, United Kingdom and the United States have used thorium in various experimental and power reactors as fuel.[2] There is a growing interest in developing thorium fuel cycle for various reasons, including its safety benefits, its high absolute abundance and relative abundance compared to uranium.[2] India's three stage nuclear power programme is possibly the most well known and well funded of such efforts. [3] [4]
MrSandman 3 hours ago
+4 Votes
Wikipedia again. Not caring about anyone's rules is the mark of a sociopath.
stndyogrnd 3 hours ago
+1 Vote
LOL not not caring about other living human beings and not being able to walk in their shoes, is the mark of a sociopath..... not caring about someone else's trivial petty concerns is a mark of intelligence.
Dr.Doom 2 hours ago
"not not caring about other living human beings and not being able to walk in their shoes, is the mark of a sociopath"
Self identifying?
Self identifying?
Maxyasgur 3 hours ago
+1 Vote
My Mom and her husband live up in Reno. They just put solar panels on their house and they are already generating in excess of their needs. Her husband is an engineer, and he was telling me that the efficiency of the panels has jumped since the time he first considered it. For what it's worth, they are both very right leaning and he wants his next car to be electric. Living here where we do, you and I are both in a fortunate spot to take advantage of solar. Not everyone can, but just think about how much need could be taken off the grid if the places that can take advantage of it did. Here in Vegas, I see very few solar panels anywhere. And, I also see an enormous amount of jacked up pickup trucks with enormous engines that never leave the street. less
louman 3 hours ago
+1 Vote
The cost is the stumbling block for solar. 32K to put panels on the house. Didn't want to calculate the length of return on the investment as it would exceed my life's expectancy.
Price comes down it will become a viable alternative.
Price comes down it will become a viable alternative.
Maxyasgur 3 hours ago
Despite their right leaning ways, they were happy to take advantage of the government rebate. I guess I look at this way; if I owned a home, I would do it, even if it didn't pay for itself in two years. I think part of the issue is that a lot of people don't want to do it unless it's "free". IE, they want the cost of it recouped in five years or less. I tend to believe many people will not apply the same calculus to remodeling their home. The price has and will continue to come down, but related to my comment below, I think it is going to remain inefficient for a long time and that will be by design.
louman 3 hours ago
Went a different route and put in a high efficiency air conditioner, shutters on the windows. Works pretty well as the temp in the house stays in the low 70's until late afternoon and then the air kicks on for a few hours. runs until 9PM or so open the house trun on the attic fan.
Keeps the electric bill in the summer around 90 a month which is ok compared to the 300+ the neighbors pay.
We have socially engineered electric in the summer. low rate for the first 500KW, x2 after that. Small apt uses 500Kw if the go easy on the Air Cond.
Keeps the electric bill in the summer around 90 a month which is ok compared to the 300+ the neighbors pay.
We have socially engineered electric in the summer. low rate for the first 500KW, x2 after that. Small apt uses 500Kw if the go easy on the Air Cond.
Maxyasgur 2 hours ago
+1 Vote
If everyone did that, the entire country could save enormously on it's energy consumption. That was kind of my point above. Well below the point of esoteric new energy sources is a lot of low hanging fruit that we don't pick. Objectively, I don't think a lot of discussions at the national level are conducted in an adult manner. Power companies sell power. They don't have incentive to push for less energy consumption. People of course want to cut their bills and some want to cut their bills and see less environmental impact. Between the power companies and people, I see mismatched priorities. How do we adress that?
Maxyasgur 3 hours ago
While complaining about agencies like the EPA, it is clear that we don't want to even do what we can. I get on average about 31 mpg with my escape hybrid, which isn't stellar, but it's still putting out a LOT less emission then the ginormous trucks that pull up next to me at stoplights. I don't want to nationalize the grip per se, but that is a big part of the problem. It's privately owned and power companies have no incentive to rebuild it for efficiency. If we got rid of the EPA tomorrow, this particular issue would not change. If you make more money selling more KW's, why invest in changing your part of the grid to make it easier for people to consume less power? Bottom line, before saying there's no solution if it doesn't power every home in America, why don't we at least pick the low hanging fruit. Looking at your map link, I see a lot of space that could still generate a lot of power. less
louman 3 hours ago
Max,
Bought a 2007 Escape. Had a 6 speed custom transmission put in and it averages 32 on the road instead of 24. Still terrible around town so it's mainly used on trips. it's paid for itself which is the way it should be.
Bought a 2007 Escape. Had a 6 speed custom transmission put in and it averages 32 on the road instead of 24. Still terrible around town so it's mainly used on trips. it's paid for itself which is the way it should be.
Maxyasgur 2 hours ago
+1 Vote
I've seen some conversion kits that add some battery space on top of the factory package and they claim to get substantially more millage out of them. Unfortunately, most of the packages are for Prius's. The one for the Escape is $16k. I have seriously thought about getting it, but I just can't justify it as that would wipe out a big chunk of savings. My driving here is actually more expressway then street. But, I also make an effort to drive without stomping on the gas and I use cruise control at any speed 35 and up. Considering traffic moves here at around 70, I'm still getting good millage for a car that was designed to get it's best millage on city streets.
louman 2 hours ago
They are MD'ing the Hybrid escape as they have the new ECO engine and standard 6 peed transmission in the next model. 30+ miles to the gallon. 24 around town.
stndyogrnd 2 hours ago
I just saw a Porche high end hypbrid that has 500 hp and gets 71 mpg.... not thats not for the general public, but shows it can be done with power also.
stndyogrnd 2 hours ago
+1 Vote
The real question is not why doesn't Iran use horium, but why aren't we R& D ing plants that do. Then we could use that as a carrot to get Iran to swich over, as well as use it to generate our electricity with out the saftey and very expensive waste problems that come with traditiona nuclear plants... the reason is of course that some corporate interest is blocking that sort of legislation that would create those incentives. Our Government has a long history of incentivizing all sorts of innovation, from the rail road, to communications, to electricity infrastructure, to airlines, to pharmacology, to health care. Government haters are loath to admit to that , but those are the facts of the reality we live in.
stndyogrnd 2 hours ago
Government rarely runs into opposition to create insentives, until those insentives are views as a threat to established economic interests. Then those interest, start priming the pump of their right wing minions to begin talking about how "Government can't do anything". This is why American innovation has shrunk since 1999.. the biginning of the Repulican leadership of this country for the next decade..... and what a miserable failure it has been, and will continue to be, because the Repulican party has put all their ideological eggs in the single basket that preaches that Government must be a failure. That means in order for them to get power they must insure that Government fails in everything it does..... this is a self limiting negative sefl fulfiling prophecy, that will always lead to disaster. less
Twinsdad 24 minutes ago
So, three hours has gone by and no has answered the question in the topic
"For the United States are there really any alternative sources of energy that are financially viable?
Hence, I will take that as no, there isn't alternative sources of energy that are financially viable.
And that my fine friends here was the point of the topic. I see all sides represented here, but I fail to see the answer, having said that why are we pursueing all these boutique energy sources when the real problem is
1. "the grid"
2. The belief that there is a solution because the greatest minds on this earth have yet to find it
3. Why is the government more interested in short term political solutions instead of long term large scale soultions? less
"For the United States are there really any alternative sources of energy that are financially viable?
Hence, I will take that as no, there isn't alternative sources of energy that are financially viable.
And that my fine friends here was the point of the topic. I see all sides represented here, but I fail to see the answer, having said that why are we pursueing all these boutique energy sources when the real problem is
1. "the grid"
2. The belief that there is a solution because the greatest minds on this earth have yet to find it
3. Why is the government more interested in short term political solutions instead of long term large scale soultions? less
Twinsdad 23 minutes ago
If the southern and western US get all the sun, where is the government effort to harvest it?
ROJODEE 1 minute ago
Twins..that is why you are seeing more of your data centers move there
also it may not be well known but all your military bases are moving to a " micro grid' config. able to stand alone...happening as we speak matter of fact
also it may not be well known but all your military bases are moving to a " micro grid' config. able to stand alone...happening as we speak matter of fact
Cougardan 1 minute ago
We spoke of this before.....bases definitely would benefit....
.....but another consideration.....how many answers lie on shelves of bought out patents and how many "creations" or "technologies" exist that are confiscated by our government or developed for our government and held in the name of national security......
......for now, the oil game is too massive a money maker for our gov and it's puppet masters and the flow of money dictates all......
....the answer to Twins thread is found in his own post under #3:
"3. Why is the government more interested in short term ... political solutions instead of long term large scale soultions?"
.....but another consideration.....how many answers lie on shelves of bought out patents and how many "creations" or "technologies" exist that are confiscated by our government or developed for our government and held in the name of national security......
......for now, the oil game is too massive a money maker for our gov and it's puppet masters and the flow of money dictates all......
....the answer to Twins thread is found in his own post under #3:
"3. Why is the government more interested in short term ... political solutions instead of long term large scale soultions?"
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